The Listing Bits Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player!
Greg Robertson sits down with Joe Kazzoun, CEO of Remine, for a wide-ranging conversation on real estate technology, forms, MLS dynamics, and Remine’s path forward under new ownership. Joe walks through his career across brokerage tech, transaction management, and proptech, then digs into lessons learned from Instanet, Lone Wolf, Dotloop/Zillow, and his return to Remine. The discussion focuses on software bloat, member benefits vs. direct sales, and how Remine is simplifying its product strategy to regain stability and growth.
Joe Kazzoun’s career arc spans brokerage tech, transaction management, and proptech leadership, shaping his pragmatic view of software in organized real estate.
The forms and transaction management market became fragmented due to MLSs seeking control over technology choices rather than relying solely on association member benefits.
Dotloop’s success highlighted the power of direct-to-agent sales, strong customer support, and simplicity over feature overload.
Software bloat—especially in MLS environments driven by committee decisions—often hurts usability more than it helps adoption.
Remine struggled under MLS ownership due to governance complexity and delayed cost-cutting, leading to a public sale process.
Remine’s acquisition by Place (Ben Kinney & Chris Suarez) stabilized the company, reduced redundancy, and moved it toward break-even.
Going forward, Remine is focusing on clarity: prospecting, public record/tax data, simple MLS search, and Docs+—not trying to be everything at once.
Remine is re-positioning its tax and public records tools as a standalone value for MLSs, alongside continued sales to MLSs, associations, and directly to agents and teams.
Email: jkazoon@remine.com
Trackxi – Real Estate’s #1 Deal Tracking Software
Giant Steps Job Board – Where ORE gets hired
Greg sits down with returning guest Annie Ives, CEO of CLAW/The MLS™, to discuss major industry changes following NAR policy shifts, the rise of MLS-only memberships, exclusive-listing strategies, and the rapid growth of CLAW’s in-house technology products including Vesta Plus, Checkmate, Showing software, and MarketSnap. Annie also shares insights on managing a high-end market, delivering strong customer service, and the future role of MLSs in a shifting industry.
Key Takeaways
NAR’s policy changes are already increasing MLS-only membership interest, especially in California’s Thompson state environment.
Annie expects MLS-only membership to rise from ~15% to potentially 25–30% as agents look to cut costs.
Associations may face pressure to restate their value proposition as non-dues revenue becomes increasingly important.
CLAW is launching a new listing status: MLS Exclusive — allowing listings to remain off-market-facing while still visible to MLS members.
MLS Exclusive listings accrue no DOM and no public price-change history while in that status.
CLAW continues to grow its in-house technology stack, including:
Vesta Plus MLS platform
Checkmate compliance software (now used by ~200k agents)
Showing software
MarketSnap analytics
Annie credits their success to customization, rapid iteration, and client-driven feature development.
She predicts MLSs will increasingly become technology companies, especially as revenue from dues becomes less stable.
Future industry direction remains uncertain, but Annie emphasizes persistence, adaptability, and building strong teams as core to longevity.
Links:
Trackxi – Real Estate’s #1 Deal Tracking Software
Giant Steps Job Board – Where ORE gets hired